[00:00:00] Dondra Ritzenthaler: You have to make the decision, am I gonna freeze or I'm gonna go negative and give up? Mm-hmm. Or I'm gonna be completely positive and have a lion's mentality and, [00:00:10] and wrap my arms around our team and say, "Come on, guys. Let's go. What do we need to do?" Some people are afraid of AI or technology or, you know, and we are [00:00:20] not. At Azamara Cruises, we absolutely are not.

[00:00:23] Dondra Ritzenthaler: We embrace it. Being smart about your spend, making sure that you're making the right business decisions from a [00:00:30] deployment standpoint and, you know, what your experience is. All of those things, if you don't have that mentality, will not have the same result. This has given us the ability to [00:00:40] at, you know, at the click of a, of a mouse key, we literally can go in and say, "Here's the areas that we need to be focusing on."

[00:00:48] Ruben Harris: Happy Thursday. My [00:00:50] name's Ruben Harris, and this is The New Normal. The New Normal is a show where we go inside of organizations that are actually using AI in production at scale in [00:01:00] a way that's making a meaningful impact in their organizations. This is not a show about hype. It's a show where we interview leaders who have made decisions to reimagine their organizations with [00:01:10] AI at its core.

[00:01:12] Ruben Harris: Today, I'm here with my co-host, our Head of Travel, Jeff Herzfeld, who is going to introduce our guest. Jeff, can you please introduce the guest?

[00:01:18] Jeff Herzfeld: Yes, absolutely. I'm [00:01:20] very excited to welcome Dondra Ritzenthaler to our show today. Thank you for joining us.

[00:01:23] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Absolutely.

[00:01:24] Jeff Herzfeld: Um, Dondra has quite the career, not only, uh, in the skies, but also the seas-

[00:01:29] Jeff Herzfeld: where she spent [00:01:30] 20 years as a senior executive at American Airlines, and another 20 years at, uh, Celebrity, uh, where she was, uh, responsible for sales, uh, trade [00:01:40] support and services.

[00:01:41] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Right? Absolutely.

[00:01:42] Jeff Herzfeld: So really wanna thank you for joining us today, and I think this is gonna be a very interesting conversation because if I'm not mistaken, uh, Dondra l- helped launch [00:01:50] Azamara back in 2007.

[00:01:51] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Believe it or not, I really did, so it's like coming home for me, right?

[00:01:55] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Right. So welcome, welcome to the show.

[00:01:57] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Thank you.

[00:01:57] Ruben Harris: And so Jeff did a good job of, like, touching a little [00:02:00] bit about a small part of your resume, but walk us a little bit about to, uh, about, like, a little bit about who you are and, and what brought you from the air to the sea.

[00:02:08] Dondra Ritzenthaler: So it's so funny you said a small part [00:02:10] of my resume, but it was almost all of it, right? Uh, but yeah, I was very blessed in my now 43 years. Mm-hmm. I had 20 years at American Airlines, which I [00:02:20] say all the time, American finished raising me. Mm-hmm. Uh, 'cause once I graduated college, I went to work as a flight attendant.

[00:02:27] Ruben Harris: Wow.

[00:02:27] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Okay. So believe it or not, I love the story that I get to tell, [00:02:30] that I started as a flight attendant and now a CEO. And if anybody can do it, if I can do it, anybody can do it, right? Yeah. Uh, but in my time at American, I actually had [00:02:40] 11 jobs-

[00:02:40] Ruben Harris: Okay ...

[00:02:41] Dondra Ritzenthaler: in the 20 years that I was there, and that's why I say that they finished raising me.

[00:02:44] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. Uh, they did what's called Fast Track at- Mm-hmm ... American Airlines, and as they started to see that you might [00:02:50] be somebody that they could see being a part of your future, then they put me in different jobs, and I would keep learning- Mm-hmm ... and keep learning- Mm-hmm ... and keep learning. And, uh, [00:03:00] so I was really blessed.

[00:03:01] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But a lot of the time, I had call centers.

[00:03:03] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:03:04] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And so, you know, one of the things that we're gonna talk about today- Yeah ... uh, being AI-driven and technology-driven, [00:03:10] is that experience I got at the very beginning.

[00:03:12] Ruben Harris: I love that.

[00:03:13] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Uh, yeah. And it's, it was so good for me to learn that, right? And then fast-forward, after 20 years and a day.

[00:03:19] Dondra Ritzenthaler: [00:03:20] Mm-hmm. Ruben, 20 years and a day.

[00:03:22] Ruben Harris: To the number.

[00:03:23] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Right? Mm-hmm. And b- because of the ... It was one day because I had to finish.

[00:03:26] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:03:27] Dondra Ritzenthaler: You know, it couldn't be 19 years and 364 [00:03:30] days. Yeah, no. It had to be 20 years and a day.

[00:03:31] Ruben Harris: You gotta- round numbers.

[00:03:32] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Right? And then I was very blessed to be a part of the Royal Caribbean group with the Celebrity Cruises brand- Mm-hmm

[00:03:39] Dondra Ritzenthaler: where, [00:03:40] uh, you know, I had the privilege of doing global sales really, uh, working in all the markets. And part of that was having trade support that Jeff mentioned, uh, which gave me the opportunity to [00:03:50] keep honing in on those skills that, you know, relationships and learning how to sell, learning how to teach people how to sell, how we can leverage the, the, you know, call centers, et [00:04:00] cetera.

[00:04:00] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And then I was blessed. Mm-hmm. Truly blessed, that the only part that Jeff didn't mention was now I've been the CEO of Azamara Cruises for the [00:04:10] last two years, and I can tell you that it is by far the best opportunity I've ever been given, and I surround myself with these brilliant people who are super passionate every single day.

[00:04:19] Dondra Ritzenthaler: [00:04:20] And all of the things that I said to you led me to where I am today.

[00:04:24] Ruben Harris: I feel your energy.

[00:04:25] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Oh. I love your excitement.

[00:04:26] Ruben Harris: So feel it. I can tell that you care. And-

[00:04:28] Jeff Herzfeld: May I also, if you don't mind, I wanna also [00:04:30] congratulate you because- Thank you ... I believe this year you received a lifetime achievement award for, uh, from CLIA.

[00:04:35] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I did. And you know what? I gotta tell you, sometimes awards [00:04:40] get given to people-

[00:04:41] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm ...

[00:04:41] Dondra Ritzenthaler: either because you buy it or because it's just your turn or whatever. That award really means the world to me, guys, because [00:04:50] it, it's a real award. Mm-hmm. And it's, you know, it's voted on by your peers and, uh, you know

[00:04:55] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And for me to be able to get that means that there's something along the [00:05:00] way that I did- Mm-hmm ... that made an impact in this industry that I love so much, and I will never take that award for granted, and it means the world to me.

[00:05:08] Ruben Harris: Yeah. No, and I love [00:05:10] that you, that you earned that. And speaking of the passion and the energy, I like that when you were talking about American Airlines and what you're doing today, you emphasize service as a flight [00:05:20] attendant-

[00:05:20] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Absolutely

[00:05:20] Ruben Harris: and also learning the whole time. And then now you're touching on your peers that voted for you. You and I got connected through Lisa Lutoff-Perlo. Yes. How do you know Lisa?

[00:05:29] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Well, [00:05:30] Lisa and I were peers at first- Mm-hmm ... because she was running hotel operations at Celebrity when I was running sales. Mm-hmm.

[00:05:36] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I d- I love this story about Lisa- Mm-hmm ... uh, because then she gets [00:05:40] herself promoted to- Yeah ... becoming the president at Celebrity. Mm-hmm. And the very first thing that I told her after congratulating her and told her how proud I was, I said, "Now you can [00:05:50] win every single argument."

[00:05:53] Jeff Herzfeld: Facts.

[00:05:54] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And she was laughing.

[00:05:56] Dondra Ritzenthaler: She goes, "That's probably not true." Uh, but I really [00:06:00] loved my time with Lisa. She's still a, a great friend to this day, and we were so blessed having been able to work next to each other. And then when she started leading the [00:06:10] organization, it was great because I already knew who she was, I knew how to work with her, and, uh, and we've been friends ever since.

[00:06:16] Ruben Harris: I love that. So with that said, tell us about [00:06:20] Azamara. Like, what, what is Azamara?

[00:06:22] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah. So, uh, Jeff mentioned that it- we brought it out in 2007, and, uh, it was a part of Royal Caribbean group at [00:06:30] the beginning. And then, uh, during the pandemic, we actually, um... Royal Caribbean sold Azamara, and now we're this amazing standalone brand that we [00:06:40] really love because we're small, and we're nimble, and we're quick.

[00:06:44] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But we're a four-ship, beautiful four little baby ship in, uh, [00:06:50] cruise line- Mm-hmm ... that we basically own destination immersion, right? Mm-hmm. So we're the global leader in small ship destination immersion. Mm-hmm. So Ruben, you might say, "Well, what does that mean?" Right? Mm-hmm. [00:07:00] So what we do is because of the size of our ship- Mm-hmm

[00:07:03] Dondra Ritzenthaler: we can go to the little places around the world that some of the larger ships simply can't go to. Mm-hmm. But [00:07:10] what I love about that is that when we get to these little places around the world- Mm-hmm ... we don't go in at 8:00 and leave at 4:00. Mm-hmm. We go in at 8:00, and then many times, [00:07:20] uh, we leave at either 11 o'clock at night or the next day.

[00:07:23] Jeff Herzfeld: Wow.

[00:07:24] Dondra Ritzenthaler: So we then have these late night and overnights so that people can really get- More time ... immersed in the destination, [00:07:30] which is why we say we're the leader in destination immersion, right? Mm-hmm. And then the thing that I love also is that we do things that are awesome, like White Night, but we have this [00:07:40] signature, uh, event that we call AzAmazing Evening.

[00:07:43] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm. And if you, Ruben, or you, Jeff, tried to do this on your own, you simply couldn't [00:07:50] do it. We've got the most amazing team that puts these curated, very educational, authentic experiences in place, [00:08:00] and we take the entire, uh, guests, the entire 700 guests to these events. Mm-hmm. And that also is super special.

[00:08:08] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But I will tell you- [00:08:10] That even with all of those things, we have a secret sauce.

[00:08:13] Ruben Harris: Okay.

[00:08:14] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And that secret sauce is the crew that is on board those ships. Mm-hmm. There is [00:08:20] something so magical between the relationship between the crew and our guests that while I think crew around the world on all cruise ships are phenomenal, I gotta [00:08:30] tell you- Yeah

[00:08:30] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I think we got the best.

[00:08:32] Ruben Harris: The best of the best.

[00:08:32] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Uh, because they do these little small moments. Yeah. And, uh, we even came out with a campaign not long ago called The Next Big Thing is [00:08:40] Small.

[00:08:40] Ruben Harris: I love that.

[00:08:41] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And it's talking about the small ships and the small destinations, and then those very small moments that we have between the [00:08:50] crew and the guests.

[00:08:51] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. And that combined is the sum of the parts, which is what makes Azamara Cruises so special.

[00:08:58] Ruben Harris: I mean, it's all about the little things. It's a lot about the [00:09:00] little- It is ... even in life, right? There's, like, a few memories that really stand out. Exactly. And it's interesting, this focus on not just small destinations, but the whole industry right now is [00:09:10] going for large ships.

[00:09:12] Ruben Harris: Yeah. 10- 10,000 people per ship. Yeah. And small ships, so can you talk a little bit about intimacy-

[00:09:17] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah ...

[00:09:17] Ruben Harris: and, like, a, a little bit about, like, how you think about that?

[00:09:19] Dondra Ritzenthaler: [00:09:20] So we love the fact that the industry is actually getting bigger.

[00:09:24] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:09:24] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Because what those brands do is they bring people to the industry.

[00:09:28] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:09:29] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Right? [00:09:30] And I love that- Mm-hmm ... because we want the, the business to continue to grow at all levels- Mm-hmm ... with all ships.

[00:09:35] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:09:36] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Where we fit in- Mm ... and where I love is because [00:09:40] people will go on those big ships and have a wonderful time, but they then oftentimes go, "You know what? I now know that I love cruising- Mm-hmm

[00:09:48] Dondra Ritzenthaler: but I want a little bit [00:09:50] more of an intimate experience. I wanna really get into that destination in a more immersive way." Mm-hmm. And that, guys, is where we come in, right? Mm-hmm. We [00:10:00] have these beautiful, small, intimate ships. Mm-hmm. That... I mean, the, the maximum that we have is 350 staterooms and [00:10:10] 700 guests.

[00:10:10] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah. I mean, think about how small that is- Yeah ... versus 8,000 or 9,000.

[00:10:15] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:10:15] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But it's not just the size of the ship. It's the intimacy of what we [00:10:20] do with the shore excursions that people go on. They're not big. You know, we have small shore excursions. Mm-hmm. We also do intimate things, like AzAmazing Journeys before [00:10:30] and after the cruise, for very small groups of people.

[00:10:33] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. We have these specialty restaurants that are intimate. Mm-hmm. But what I really love is that one-on-one [00:10:40] time- Mm-hmm ... and how the captain and the hotel director is so visible with our guests, and that's really what creates the intimacy. Yeah. It's not just the size of the ship. [00:10:50] It's the things that happen on board that actually make that big difference from a- Yeah

[00:10:55] Dondra Ritzenthaler: from a intimacy standpoint.

[00:10:57] Jeff Herzfeld: So if we can unpack that a little. Yeah. It sounds to me, you know, you have [00:11:00] the opportunity with the intimate ships for way more personalization at scale, so-

[00:11:04] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Way more ...

[00:11:04] Jeff Herzfeld: is that what you're talking about?

[00:11:05] Dondra Ritzenthaler: We, it is. I mean, you know, it's not only personalization on the ship, but [00:11:10] it's, you know, the personal- it's the relationships where we have, uh, with our loyalty guests.

[00:11:15] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Believe it or not, I am literally on either WhatsApp or text or email- Mm ... [00:11:20] with so many of our loyalty guests. Well, it doesn't get any more personal than that, gentlemen. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Um, but in addition to that, there's personalization with, you know, desks that are just for [00:11:30] our, our world cruise- Mm-hmm

[00:11:32] Dondra Ritzenthaler: guests, and that's super personalized, 'cause that's very different. You know- Mm ... when you're gonna commit to 188 nights, 195 nights- [00:11:40] The personalization becomes even more important, right? Yeah. And then onboard personalization, where we do sit-downs with the captains- Mm-hmm ... and we do, you know, what we call Acamar Dinner [00:11:50] that- Mm-hmm

[00:11:50] Dondra Ritzenthaler: the captain and the hotel director attend. To little things where, you know, the captains and the, and what we call the leadership team on board, the future cruise team, they [00:12:00] make themselves available and literally have one-on-one conversations.

[00:12:04] Ruben Harris: I love that.

[00:12:04] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But, see, that's what you can do when you're a small company with small ships and a [00:12:10] small group of people that are 100% in it to win it.

[00:12:13] Ruben Harris: Let's talk about this group of people- Yeah ... and personalization, right? So you have this number of ships. How many employees do you [00:12:20] have? And the reason why I'm asking this question is clearly you guys have a product and a service and, and a, a travel package and many options that [00:12:30] people really want. Yeah.

[00:12:31] Ruben Harris: So I would imagine you have hundreds of thousands or millions of leads that want to take trips with you guys. Yeah. So how many people do you have [00:12:40] trying to serve these travelers?

[00:12:41] Dondra Ritzenthaler: So we have, you know, let's start with onboard, and then we'll work to shoreside, right? So we have almost a two-to-one guest ratio.

[00:12:49] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:12:49] Dondra Ritzenthaler: So [00:12:50] when you think about it, for every one guest, we have two teammates on board-

[00:12:55] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm ...

[00:12:55] Dondra Ritzenthaler: to service that guest- Awesome ... which is amazing, right? Yes. And that's [00:13:00] everything from the crew that is in the staterooms with the guest, well, not literally- Mm-hmm ... in the staterooms with the guest. Y'all know what I mean.

[00:13:06] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah. Who take care of them, to the F&B [00:13:10] teams, to the future cruise teams, to the, you know, uh, all of the different activities that we do, to the shore excursions desk. And so we have, you know, and then we've got four [00:13:20] ships- Mm-hmm ... so if you just do the math, right? Mm-hmm. So somewhere in the neighborhood of 1,500 crew members.

[00:13:24] Jeff Herzfeld: Yep.

[00:13:25] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Then you've got our shoreside team. Mm-hmm. And I gotta tell you- Mm-hmm ... we are a [00:13:30] lean, mean, fighting machine here. Mm-hmm. We don't have that many shoreside employees. Mm-hmm. And so w- the, the, the largest number of shoreside employees [00:13:40] we have, and I'm gonna go back to our service element, is in our call centers, right?

[00:13:43] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah. And, uh, and we love that team.

[00:13:46] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:13:47] Dondra Ritzenthaler: They are home-based. They're around the country. Mm-hmm. We [00:13:50] have some that are offshore as well, and we've got somewhere in the neighborhood of 100- Yeah, yeah ... you know, of those. And then we've got our shoreside team, which I don't really [00:14:00] know the number, but it's somewhere in the neighborhood of 100.

[00:14:03] Ruben Harris: Solid. Solid.

[00:14:03] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah. That is- So but I gotta tell you, what we accomplish- [00:14:10] Representing Azamara Cruises shoreside and around the world, it's unbelievable.

[00:14:15] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah.

[00:14:15] Dondra Ritzenthaler: It's extraordinary.

[00:14:16] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah.

[00:14:17] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And we've got teammates that, you know, [00:14:20] when I was with my other companies, we would have one per- you know, there would be five people that do what one person does here.

[00:14:26] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah.

[00:14:26] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And yet every day we walk in with a lion's [00:14:30] mentality. Every day we walk in with a, you know, we walk in with a we're gonna win again today, and everybody is so aligned to that philosophy and that winning [00:14:40] culture and that winning spirit that we've got what we need.

[00:14:43] Ruben Harris: And I feel the, I feel the lioness energy.

[00:14:45] Ruben Harris: Um, so, so-

[00:14:46] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Oh, this place is full of lion's mentality, or lioness.

[00:14:49] Ruben Harris: Yeah, [00:14:50] yeah. I mean the lioness and, and I lo- I love that you, um, talked about just the, the team and everything. So there's someone that's been on our podcast that, um, used to [00:15:00] report to you. His name's Bob Becker.

[00:15:01] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yes.

[00:15:01] Ruben Harris: Right?

[00:15:02] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Know him well.

[00:15:02] Ruben Harris: And then you also hired a new head of sales, so- Yes

[00:15:06] Ruben Harris: as you all are thinking about structuring the call centers, not just for [00:15:10] your booked guests- Yeah ... but people that would like to take a trip. How are you structuring that- Yeah ... today?

[00:15:16] Dondra Ritzenthaler: So, uh, learned a ton from Bob. Mm-hmm. You know, he's [00:15:20] the guru in this business- Mm-hmm ... and many of us have actually worked with Bob Mm-hmm

[00:15:23] Dondra Ritzenthaler: you know, and that's, when you get Bob and my age- Mm-hmm ... it, it happens, right? Um, so first and [00:15:30] foremost, loved working with him. Mm-hmm. Alex Pinelo is- Mm ... our head of w- we, he's the chief sales officer for North America. Awesome. And I feel blessed. He's on day [00:15:40] three. Mm. I feel blessed that he is now a part of our team, and what I love about it is he had years at Norwegian Cruise Line, where he learned the, you know, the oceangoing cruise business.

[00:15:48] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm. And then we're so [00:15:50] lucky that he went to AmaWaterways- Mm-hmm ... and actually learned the river business. Mm-hmm. Which, just in the three days, it's amazing how much synergies there are, even though they're river and [00:16:00] we're certainly ocean, right? Mm-hmm. Uh, so really happy to have him. Mm-hmm. And he's partnered with David Siewers- Mm-hmm

[00:16:06] Dondra Ritzenthaler: who is the chief sales officer for- International ... International, which we've been blessed [00:16:10] to have, I worked with way back in the day, Jeff, when we worked together. So that's the first part of, of, Ruben, what you asked me. And then in regards to the, uh, you know, the [00:16:20] call center and, and people who, uh, our distribution channel, right?

[00:16:24] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. So we are extremely loyal and, uh, appreciate and value our [00:16:30] travel advisors around the world. Mm-hmm. Our brand is such that, you know, we don't have enough marketing dollars to where we're gonna be a household name. Mm-hmm. You know, like a [00:16:40] Nike or- Mm-hmm ... you know, something like that. We're never gonna be that.

[00:16:42] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:16:43] Dondra Ritzenthaler: So we very much depend and work in lockstep with our travel advisors around the world, because we [00:16:50] need them. Mm-hmm. And they need us- Mm-hmm ... because we provide a beautiful product that guests not only go the first time, but they come back over and over and over. So we leverage very much our [00:17:00] relationships and the marketing power that our travel advisors have to go get their customers and have them come to us.

[00:17:06] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah. That's number one. But we also know that there's [00:17:10] customers who don't know us, and don't- Mm ... know, you know, work with travel advisors. And when that's the case, we have a wonderful marketing organization- Mm ... led by Lisa Kauffman, who's our- Yeah ... [00:17:20] CMO, who does a terrific job going out and marketing. Social is now a big part of that marketing campaign- Mm-hmm

[00:17:26] Dondra Ritzenthaler: which, you know, years ago when we started, social wasn't- Nah ... even in the radar. Yeah. [00:17:30] Right? Um, and so we go out and we talk to customers that way. Our social, we've got two teammates that work on social, and they are phenomenal. Mm-hmm. And what we do [00:17:40] is we tell real stories. Mm-hmm. You know, I'm gonna give you a perfect example.

[00:17:43] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. Uh, Pursuit is in Alaska. Mm-hmm. And they just finished the last sailing. Mm-hmm. And they got [00:17:50] permission from Alaska to fish.

[00:17:52] Ruben Harris: Wow.

[00:17:52] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And so they all literally went to the, to the pier, if you will- Mm-hmm ... and they went fishing. And, [00:18:00] um, and- They told our audi- the, the, the, the guests on board that if they caught the fish, they would cook the fish and serve it that night- [00:18:10] Wow

[00:18:10] Dondra Ritzenthaler: 'cause it was a White Night- Doesn't get any fresher than that ... okay. Yeah. Except that there was one problem. They only caught two fish. Ah. But what they also said, that is if they failed- Uh-huh ... then they would [00:18:20] do a polar plunge. But instead of doing it in the water, they literally put ice in our pool, and then all of the, the folks who fished that [00:18:30] didn't actually catch the fish literally did the polar plunge, and that was their punishment- That's awesome though

[00:18:35] Dondra Ritzenthaler: because the... But see, that's the kind of stuff-

[00:18:37] Ruben Harris: Yeah, it's a great experience ...

[00:18:37] Dondra Ritzenthaler: That is a great experience. Mm-hmm. And [00:18:40] those are surprise and delights, right? Mm-hmm. But it's those types of things that then other people will see, and y'all know how things will go viral, right? Yeah. And so then we have a [00:18:50] team that is like, "Okay."

[00:18:51] Ruben Harris: It's like the ice bucket challenge.

[00:18:52] Dondra Ritzenthaler: The i- Remember the ice bucket challenge? Yeah. That was a long time ago. Mm-hmm. Nobody does that anymore. Uh, but that's also a way that we continue [00:19:00] to reach our guests. And then the other one is that our loyal guests are so loyal.

[00:19:05] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:19:05] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Like, I've never seen anything like it.

[00:19:07] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah. And it goes back to what I mentioned earlier, that they've [00:19:10] got these small moments with one another, that that's the secret sauce, and then what they do is they go tell their friends and so on and so on. Yeah. And we actually get a lot of our customers that way as well.

[00:19:19] Jeff Herzfeld: [00:19:20] So you've got a lot of intimate, you know, opportunities, uh, for personalization.

[00:19:24] Jeff Herzfeld: You have a lot of loyalty guests, you know, that just keeps coming back. You know, what makes [00:19:30] the product so popular? What do they, what do they love so much about Azamara specifically?

[00:19:33] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Well, and I love the fact that you asked that, uh, because there's table stakes, Jeff. You know, first of all, your room has to l- be [00:19:40] pretty and your bed has to be comfortable, right?

[00:19:42] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Those are table stakes. Yeah. Mm-hmm. You have to g- have great customer service. You have to have great food.

[00:19:47] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:19:47] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And we have all of those. [00:19:50] But we just invested in brand new shows because people didn't naturally think that small ships could have great entertainment. Mm-hmm. Well, we're [00:20:00] busting that myth- Mm-hmm

[00:20:01] Dondra Ritzenthaler: because we have some beautiful entertaining shows, right? Mm-hmm. Uh, we partnered with RWS. We've got 10 brand new shows, and [00:20:10] I've now seen six of the 10. Mm-hmm. And I gotta tell you, they're great.

[00:20:13] Jeff Herzfeld: And these are the experiences that become memorable, and they come home and share.

[00:20:16] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Exactly. Yeah. Um, and so [00:20:20] yes, we have invested in our culinary experience.

[00:20:22] Dondra Ritzenthaler: We now have what we call a night of music, where we, we take our culinary experience, and we couple it with [00:20:30] music, which we didn't have before. So all of these things I'm telling you, it's not one thing, it's the sum of the parts. Mm-hmm. And what I have learned in my two [00:20:40] years of having the privilege of leading this team is that I get out of the way.

[00:20:45] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I just inspire these people that are smarter than me, that they're subject [00:20:50] matter experts, and then I just make sure that if I have to knock down a wall or, you know, make sure that, that we can do it or... A- and what is happening [00:21:00] is that we're lifting the experience in so many different ways, and we're working on the experience here, and we're leveraging AI here, and we're doing the things that we need to do.

[00:21:09] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And [00:21:10] when you add those things up, that's why our guests are coming back and coming back and coming back. Because we all know, because we've been in this business a long time, [00:21:20] if you don't deliver on your promise, you will not get that customer back.

[00:21:25] Ruben Harris: Definitely not.

[00:21:25] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And in the last two years, we have doubled the amount of future cruise [00:21:30] sales than we did before the last two years.

[00:21:33] Ruben Harris: Congratulations.

[00:21:33] Jeff Herzfeld: That says a lot, that they're having such a great time- It's- ... on their vacation, they book their next one on board ...

[00:21:37] Dondra Ritzenthaler: 100%. Yeah. So- And it's all about what's [00:21:40] happening, not only before the cruise starts, but then once they get on. And I'm so proud of our teams that are delivering on that in such a beautiful way that we're seeing these kinds of [00:21:50] future cruise results.

[00:21:51] Ruben Harris: I love that. So let, let's talk about the technology side now. So you already started doubling sales, right? Help us understand [00:22:00] How many inquiries you all get a year Yeah, yeah ... and this, it's okay if it's estimates, and what is the relationship between the travel advisors, the 100 people in your call [00:22:10] center, and how you are thinking about things where AI or AI agents can help them?

[00:22:15] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah.

[00:22:16] Dondra Ritzenthaler: So let's, let's start with the, you know, the, [00:22:20] first of all, travel advisors make up the majority by far.

[00:22:23] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:22:23] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Like, 80-plus percent of our product is sold by our travel partners. Mm-hmm. That's a lot, guys. That's a lot,

[00:22:28] Ruben Harris: yeah.

[00:22:29] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And, you [00:22:30] know, and in many cases, cruise lines don't even share that information.

[00:22:34] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I'm so happy and proud to share it because- Yeah ... our relationship with travel advisors is so [00:22:40] real.

[00:22:40] Ruben Harris: And special.

[00:22:41] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And it's so special, and they all know it, and frankly, I think the relationship that I had with travel advisors is one of the reasons that I'm [00:22:50] here today- Mm-hmm ... as your leader, right? Mm-hmm. Um, so let's start with that.

[00:22:54] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:22:55] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But then in addition to that, we all have had to [00:23:00] embrace technology, right? 'Cause people are gonna react one of two ways. Mm-hmm. I was just reading an article two days ago-

[00:23:07] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm ...

[00:23:07] Dondra Ritzenthaler: that [00:23:10] some people are afraid of AI or technology or, you know, and we are not.

[00:23:16] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:23:17] Dondra Ritzenthaler: At Azamara Cruises, we absolutely are not.

[00:23:19] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm. [00:23:20] We embrace it.

[00:23:21] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:23:21] Dondra Ritzenthaler: We're doing it very strategically.

[00:23:23] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:23:24] Dondra Ritzenthaler: You know, we don't feel the need to be the first guy out, you know- Mm-hmm ... or to, to lead in, you know, [00:23:30] if we're doing this with AI or that with AI. We wanna be really smart about it.

[00:23:35] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:23:35] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And we wanna be methodical about it. And we've got, you know, Jorge, and [00:23:40] we've got James, and we've got Manny and the team here, that their focus- Mm-hmm

[00:23:45] Dondra Ritzenthaler: is how can we leverage AI, not only in our call center- [00:23:50] Mm-hmm ... but as a team here. Mm-hmm. What we do from a, you know, on board with are we, do we have waste in our food, and how we're leveraging those types of things. But what I want [00:24:00] y'all to understand is we are open-minded. We are embracing it. We are getting the tools.

[00:24:07] Dondra Ritzenthaler: We're getting the data.

[00:24:09] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:24:09] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Because [00:24:10] we all know that AI is all data-driven.

[00:24:12] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah.

[00:24:12] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And Jorge was, you know, making sure, "Dondra, make sure that all of these listeners know that we're more [00:24:20] interested in doing it strategically, at the right pace, using data-

[00:24:26] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm ...

[00:24:26] Dondra Ritzenthaler: as the base so that as we build and we [00:24:30] use AI more and more, it's coming from the right base and the right foundation."

[00:24:34] Ruben Harris: Yeah. No.

[00:24:34] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And that's where we're at with it. Uh, but we've definitely invested in [00:24:40] people.

[00:24:40] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:24:40] Dondra Ritzenthaler: We've invested in tools, you know, whether it's Claude or, uh, you know, others because our mentality, and I mentioned it earlier in this, in this [00:24:50] time together, is we have a lion's mentality.

[00:24:52] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:24:53] Dondra Ritzenthaler: So if AI's coming and it can help us, let's go.

[00:24:56] Ruben Harris: Yeah. No, it makes a lot of sense. And speaking of people, [00:25:00] let's just, let's pretend that you could hire unlimited people.

[00:25:04] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Oh, goodness.

[00:25:04] Ruben Harris: Right? To-

[00:25:05] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Wouldn't that be great?

[00:25:05] Ruben Harris: Right? To optimize the guest and travel experience-

[00:25:09] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yes ...

[00:25:09] Ruben Harris: [00:25:10] to not only serve them better, but grow revenue, right? Yeah. More, more, more people book, more revenue, right?

[00:25:16] Ruben Harris: So how do you, how would you de- how would you organize those people?

[00:25:19] Dondra Ritzenthaler: That's [00:25:20] such a great question. Well, the first thing I would do is go to my team and ask them that because they're the subject matter experts, right? Yeah. So first and foremost, I would go, "What do you think?" Right? [00:25:30] Mm-hmm. Um, intuitively- And I'm gonna start on the ship and work my way back.

[00:25:34] Jeff Herzfeld: Yep.

[00:25:35] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Future cruise is our, it's, it's our leading indicator.

[00:25:39] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:25:39] Dondra Ritzenthaler: When we [00:25:40] do well in future cruise, first of all, it base-loads how far we're booked out.

[00:25:43] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah.

[00:25:44] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And when we continue to do well there- Mm-hmm ... there's only certain amount of time. So if I added [00:25:50] another future cruise headcount, then what would happen is that I would get that much more sales, right?

[00:25:56] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. So let's start there.

[00:25:57] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:25:58] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I would definitely have more [00:26:00] people in my call centers- Mm-hmm ... uh, working with our guests so that I could be even more personalized. Mm-hmm. So I would have a world cruise desk. Mm-hmm. I would have a top producer desk. Mm-hmm. I would have, you [00:26:10] know, first-to-brand desk- Mm-hmm

[00:26:12] Dondra Ritzenthaler: so that we could even go more. Mm-hmm. But we all know that sometimes that's difficult- Mm-hmm ... because you wanna maximize call [00:26:20] time and hold times- Mm-hmm ... and, you know. And so that's where you can leverage your AI tools to say- Mm-hmm ... "Let's get that base and that foundation done, and then let's go to a, [00:26:30] quote unquote, 'live person'- Mm-hmm

[00:26:31] Dondra Ritzenthaler: so that we can then close that sale." Mm-hmm. Because when you're talking to someone live, you can then sell up- Mm-hmm ... you can answer questions better. You know, you can book a second [00:26:40] cruise. Mm-hmm. And so those things come into play there.

[00:26:42] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah.

[00:26:42] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And then probably what I would do is I would even hire a person in my deployment team-

[00:26:47] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm

[00:26:47] Dondra Ritzenthaler: because we're the destination immersion [00:26:50] brand.

[00:26:50] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:26:50] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And I would love to have even more time, and looking further out in the future, to say, "Where are the next stops that we could do- Mm-hmm ... that are these little- Mm ... [00:27:00] bitty nuggets around the world that- Mm-hmm ... you know, A, the big guys can't go to, and B, we don't know about?"

[00:27:04] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:27:05] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And, uh, so those are the ones that come into my mind. Yeah. Um, I would probably hire more [00:27:10] salespeople.

[00:27:10] Ruben Harris: Yeah, yeah.

[00:27:11] Dondra Ritzenthaler: You know what I mean? I would probably hire more marketing people- Yeah ... because then we could get deeper in, you know, could we go further in search? Could we- Mm-hmm ... figure out [00:27:20] how AI could help us more get to the right people faster?

[00:27:23] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. And so, uh, but we're also a lean mean fighting machine. Yeah. And what we also wanna do is, uh, is be careful [00:27:30] where we invest because we wanna make sure that we hit targets, whether they be EBITDA targets or whatever. Yeah. And that's the balance, Ruben, to- Exactly ... if you could and you were queen of the day, [00:27:40] I also wanna make sure that we, 'cause we have a responsibility to our shareholders, and to make sure that we run this company with passion and commitment and [00:27:50] maniacal focus, but also in a way that gets the right returns.

[00:27:52] Ruben Harris: Well, you're, you're not just the queen of the day, you've been the queen for years, right? So you-

[00:27:55] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I'm hanging in there, man.

[00:27:56] Ruben Harris: Right. And you, and you, and you, and you, and you, and you shared a lot of [00:28:00] really interesting use cases, right? And the reason why I said that is a lot of people don't even know the difference between a chatbot, a copilot, and an AI agent.

[00:28:07] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yep.

[00:28:08] Ruben Harris: At least on our end, we [00:28:10] think about- AI agents as digital labor, and this is a format where you can disagree with this, but let's assume that it's digital labor, right? That is, and the fact [00:28:20] that we cannot hire unlimited humans, and to your point, we're limited on time.

[00:28:24] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah.

[00:28:24] Ruben Harris: How do you think about the collaboration or the, uh, [00:28:30] the new hybrid teams that are humans with agents- Right

[00:28:34] Ruben Harris: and how you deploy them?

[00:28:36] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah, so in my mind, there's nothing [00:28:40] that is ever gonna take the place of a human.

[00:28:42] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:28:42] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Never. I think the difference is it's the humans that figure out how to leverage AI are gonna be more successful than the humans that [00:28:50] don't.

[00:28:50] Ruben Harris: That's right.

[00:28:50] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Right? And I think leveraging, uh, you know, AI to do all of the, the pre-work, if you will.

[00:28:59] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. [00:29:00] And pre is, you know, that's a kind of a loose term. Mm-hmm. But, you know, let's, let's get all the information that we can do to be educated about- Mm ... who this guest is and what are they [00:29:10] looking for so that we can then leverage the, what I'll say is the closer, if you will- Yeah ... in with a live person.

[00:29:17] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. Right? Mm-hmm. And, [00:29:20] and by the way, I may not be using the right terminology, so keep me honest if I'm not.

[00:29:20] Ruben Harris: No, this is the right terminology.

[00:29:25] Ruben Harris: Well, nobody- Here's the reality. Nobody knows anything.

[00:29:26] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Okay, good. So-

[00:29:26] Ruben Harris: Like, we're all, you're the leader- And everybody wants to work with you guys.

[00:29:28] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But see, I'm not- But see, I'm not [00:29:30] like that.

[00:29:30] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Right. I don't pretend like I know everything, man. Mm-hmm. And that's made me very successful in my life. Mm-hmm. I'm like, hey, I'm not the smartest one. Mm-hmm. But I'm smart enough to know that. Yeah. Right? But- [00:29:40] Then to me, what happens is, is that then you leverage that person- Mm-hmm ... and you leverage the relationship that they have.

[00:29:46] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. And then they're now completely [00:29:50] educated.

[00:29:50] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:29:50] Dondra Ritzenthaler: They have done all of this using is our team, and our AI, and- Mm-hmm ... all of the tools that we're, that we're bringing into our company now, and [00:30:00] let's use those.

[00:30:01] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:30:01] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And let's keep our headcount down for that reason, but let's never think that we don't need a closer-

[00:30:07] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:30:08] Dondra Ritzenthaler: In making sure that we make sure [00:30:10] that guest is happy, and that they know exactly what they're getting, and that we had the opportunity to make sure that if they needed something after the cruise sale, whether it be the Experience More [00:30:20] packages, or the AzAmazing Journeys beforehand, or, you know, upgrade to a suite, or do specialty dining.

[00:30:26] Dondra Ritzenthaler: All of those things, that human-to-human connection and that [00:30:30] personalization that you talked about, Jeff, is critical-

[00:30:33] Ruben Harris: Yeah ...

[00:30:33] Dondra Ritzenthaler: to then the repeat ratio, to customers loving us, to then booking a future cruise. And that's why I [00:30:40] see this as one big thing- Yeah ... and not isolated things.

[00:30:42] Jeff Herzfeld: So if I can, if I can, uh, chime in for a moment.

[00:30:45] Jeff Herzfeld: What I, what I'm hearing is, like, there's potentially an opportunity for there to be more [00:30:50] time to actually sell and speak to more guests. So if you're taking some of, like, the, the tasks that a lot of salespeople have to do- Yeah ... like making the final payment calls or supporting with web check-in-

[00:30:59] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Right

[00:30:59] Jeff Herzfeld: maybe [00:31:00] those are potential opportunities where digital assistants can fit in?

[00:31:03] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah, and, and I'll be honest, I'm gonna go to my expert, you know? I've got, um, Angel, who runs the call center. He's- [00:31:10] Mm ... super smart about that. I've got Jorge, and Ma- James, and Manny, and that team. We're going to leverage those things.

[00:31:18] Dondra Ritzenthaler: We are not afraid of them.

[00:31:20] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:31:20] Dondra Ritzenthaler: We, again, I'm gonna be repetitive on purpose, we're not feeling pressure to go too fast to then not leverage data and not leverage the best [00:31:30] tools- Mm-hmm ... and the best team. But intuitively, Jeff, if you can not have to do things like, "I need a name change," or, "Final payment"- There you go.

[00:31:39] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm ... or those [00:31:40] types of things, intuitively, um, it just means that you spend more time really getting to know your customers, asking for referrals, those things [00:31:50] that have an ROI that a doing a name change or a final payment don't have as much of.

[00:31:55] Ruben Harris: So- I was gonna ask about that. Like, if... Are, what are the repetitive things that are [00:32:00] necessary for a trip, like passport verification or something like that- Oh

[00:32:03] Ruben Harris: that humans may not enjoy doing as much, or where their time could be leveraged better that you think a [00:32:10] digital worker can do, versus things that a human is best positioned to do?

[00:32:14] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Well, first and foremost, we gotta make sure that we get the right data- Mm-hmm ... to be able to [00:32:20] answer that with facts versus just what we think, right?

[00:32:23] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. Um, I would never take a chance on, you know, you need a visa. And, and we, [00:32:30] and we don't have that be, you know- somebody that we know will make sure that's right. Mm-hmm. Because then you're hurting your customer.

[00:32:37] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:32:37] Dondra Ritzenthaler: So I don't know if I [00:32:40] would say things like visa or, uh, you know, passport or those types of things, 'cause that might mean that somebody goes home instead of getting on the ship, and I don't know- Mm-hmm

[00:32:48] Dondra Ritzenthaler: that I would wanna take that [00:32:50] chance.

[00:32:50] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:32:51] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But things like, you know, final payment or, uh, you know, where on the website do I find, uh, shore [00:33:00] excursions- Mm-hmm ... or some of those. Mm-hmm. And I think most of the people that are gonna see this-

[00:33:04] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm ...

[00:33:04] Dondra Ritzenthaler: probably already have that.

[00:33:06] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:33:07] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But I also want y'all to know, Ruben, that [00:33:10] I don't see AI and the, and the tools that we can get just for call centers.

[00:33:16] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I know that- Mm-hmm ... that's what everybody thinks at first. Mm-hmm. But I [00:33:20] cannot tell you how much more productive we are here-

[00:33:22] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm ...

[00:33:23] Dondra Ritzenthaler: with Claude.

[00:33:25] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:33:25] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And, you know, sitting and putting in, okay, we're gonna put in this contract and we're gonna see [00:33:30] what it comes out. Mm. Now, that doesn't mean that we don't then go verify it, right?

[00:33:33] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. But it's also those types of things- Mm-hmm ... that our company, because of the size of who we are and [00:33:40] how we are lean and everybody does multiple things- Mm-hmm ... we're gonna leverage those things to make us more efficient.

[00:33:45] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:33:46] Dondra Ritzenthaler: The, and so it's beyond the call center.

[00:33:48] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah, makes sense. You know, and that, that, I think that's, [00:33:50] and you, you touched on this with the data aspect of it, because the, the more data you have on, on your customers, the more you're able to really curate the vacation.

[00:33:59] Jeff Herzfeld: So what [00:34:00] is the next best action? What shore excursions- Absolutely ... you know, do you recommend? Is that something where, you know, digital assistants can come and really qualify them for what their experience-

[00:34:08] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah ...

[00:34:08] Jeff Herzfeld: may wanna be onboard the [00:34:10] ship.

[00:34:10] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I mean, think about it. We've all been on the phone-

[00:34:13] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm ...

[00:34:13] Dondra Ritzenthaler: and it's, it's really not a real person, but man, you wouldn't know it.

[00:34:17] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah.

[00:34:17] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:34:18] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Unless you're in the business- Yeah, [00:34:20] for sure ... you wouldn't know it. For sure. For sure. And I think, Jeff, those are some of the things, you know, like, "Hey, tell me where you think your shore excursion, where you wanna go on your shore excursion." I think the, the beginning of [00:34:30] some of those things can be fine, but I still will go back to the fact that when you start to close, nobody ever is gonna take the place of a [00:34:40] person to person.

[00:34:40] Jeff Herzfeld: Absolutely. Yeah. 100%.

[00:34:40] Dondra Ritzenthaler: It just, I just don't believe it.

[00:34:42] Ruben Harris: You, and you tou- you touched on ROI earlier.

[00:34:45] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah.

[00:34:45] Ruben Harris: Right? And so-

[00:34:46] Dondra Ritzenthaler: 'Cause everything we do has to have one.

[00:34:48] Ruben Harris: Right. And given that [00:34:50] nobody knows what the future is, but we're all seeing that AI's like- the new internet and the greatest business opportunity ever.

[00:34:59] Ruben Harris: [00:35:00] But, like, it has to be done carefully with the right data in a personal way- Mm-hmm ... that doesn't replace the human. How do you think about investments, about what makes ROI and what doesn't [00:35:10] make ROI? 'Cause from my perspective, I see a lot of people talking about productivity and efficiency. Is that all you need to see to make an investment, or how do you think [00:35:20] about ROI?

[00:35:21] Dondra Ritzenthaler: No, I think you have to see more than that- Mm-hmm ... but you certainly, those are table stakes to me. Yeah. Right? You're not gonna make an investment in any tool if you don't get efficiency- Mm ... now in [00:35:30] this time, right? Yeah. It just doesn't make any sense. Mm-hmm. Uh, but it's, it's gotta be more than that- Mm-hmm

[00:35:34] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I think.

[00:35:35] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah.

[00:35:35] Dondra Ritzenthaler: You know, I think, um, you've gotta be able to be more [00:35:40] efficient. You've gotta be able to figure out how can you learn more-

[00:35:43] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm ...

[00:35:44] Dondra Ritzenthaler: that make you make decisions on innovations. Mm-hmm. And it's those types of things as well, right? Yeah. Because if we [00:35:50] just go down to how we're gonna save money, that's great.

[00:35:53] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:35:54] Dondra Ritzenthaler: If we just go down to, um, you know, how to be efficient, like doing reports on board to see [00:36:00] if you've got food waste- Mm ... and those types, those are all great.

[00:36:03] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:36:03] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But there also has to be revenue-generating opportunities as well. Yeah. Yeah. And that takes us back to let's have [00:36:10] the beginning of the call, but then transfer over, uh, and- Mm-hmm

[00:36:13] Dondra Ritzenthaler: those are the types of things. Yeah. Here's another thing, is that Angel now using, um... And I don't know [00:36:20] if we can say this, but hopefully we can, is he uses Balto. Mm-hmm. And it teaches us what are the, what are the, the highest Uh, [00:36:30] complaints that we get. It's important. And we're very lucky, y'all. Yeah. 'Cause we get, we get very few.

[00:36:35] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah.

[00:36:35] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Because on board they just, they crush it all the time. Mm-hmm. But what are those [00:36:40] things? Yeah. So n- now this has given us the ability to at, you know, at the click of a, of a mouse key, we literally can go in and say, "Here's the areas [00:36:50] that we need to be focusing on."

[00:36:51] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:36:52] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Now, when we then know that-

[00:36:54] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm

[00:36:54] Dondra Ritzenthaler: and then we leverage AI to see how we can fix it- Mm-hmm ... and then we leverage people to go in and, and do it.

[00:36:59] Ruben Harris: [00:37:00] Yeah.

[00:37:00] Dondra Ritzenthaler: What then happens is that we fix that. Yeah. Then our guests are even happier, and that- Yeah ... generates more bookings, and that generates more revenue.

[00:37:07] Ruben Harris: Yeah.

[00:37:08] Dondra Ritzenthaler: So to me, it's just [00:37:10] as much about how you can leverage these tools using data-

[00:37:14] Ruben Harris: Yeah

[00:37:14] Dondra Ritzenthaler: and being strategic to make sure that it's not only savings and being more efficient, but how you generate [00:37:20] more m- more revenue. I love it. 'Cause it is all about ROI.

[00:37:22] Ruben Harris: That, and I love that example, 'cause that, that example, feedback is a gift, right? It's a gift. And if people aren't sharing it with you, you don't know what the issues are.

[00:37:29] Ruben Harris: [00:37:30] Um, I like that you mentioned opportunities outside the call center. And it's okay if this doesn't exist when I ask this question, but are there areas outside of the call center where you [00:37:40] are making more than you're spending with AI right now?

[00:37:44] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Um, I think it's a terrific question. And I will honestly tell you I'm not sure yet.

[00:37:49] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:37:50] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Because I'll go back to the beginning. We are going strategically. Mm-hmm. We are going at the pace that we think makes sense for our organization.

[00:37:58] Jeff Herzfeld: Yep.

[00:37:59] Dondra Ritzenthaler: We [00:38:00] are using data-

[00:38:01] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm ...

[00:38:01] Dondra Ritzenthaler: to make sure that the foundation and that the base is right so that as we learn and listen and leverage, that, that we [00:38:10] really are seeing that, right?

[00:38:11] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah. Uh, so I would say that I would want you to come back and ask me that question- In another six months, in another year. Okay. I [00:38:20] believe that we are because I can see what we're learning from what I talked about, Balto, how we're learning from Claude, how we're learning and how we're using the, the, [00:38:30] the AI for the call center and then closing with people.

[00:38:34] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But I don't have enough data to say, "Yes, Ruben, we've made 22% more-

[00:38:39] Ruben Harris: Yeah ...

[00:38:39] Dondra Ritzenthaler: [00:38:40] because of this." I'm not ready to tell you that yet.

[00:38:42] Ruben Harris: Yeah. In the next six months, what do you-

[00:38:44] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Do you wanna come back and do this again?

[00:38:46] Ruben Harris: Oh, for sure. Sure, yeah. But I also am curious, in the next [00:38:50] six months, what do you think leaders like yourself and your peers will be doing then that they're not doing now leveraging technology?

[00:38:57] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Well, the first thing I'm gonna say without giving that a [00:39:00] second thought is that I'm gonna be listening to my team, who are the experts about this.

[00:39:04] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

[00:39:05] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Because I do not profess to be the guru in this. Mm-hmm. But my mind is [00:39:10] open.

[00:39:10] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:39:11] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And I am, and I'm hungry to listen to my team- Mm-hmm ... who's gonna continue to tell us where we need to invest.

[00:39:19] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah. I [00:39:20] will continue to read 'cause I'm a huge reader. I get up every day. Unfortunately, I get up at 5:00 every morning without an alarm, which I don't know why I do that.

[00:39:28] Ruben Harris: Blessings.

[00:39:28] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Well, maybe [00:39:30] some good, some bad, right? Mm-hmm. But I read so much- Mm-hmm ... guys, and I'm a, I'm a sponge for knowledge, and AI is constantly, [00:39:40] you know, in stories or whether in reading the Wall Street Journal- Mm-hmm

[00:39:43] Dondra Ritzenthaler: or, you know, whatever, and I'm gonna continue to read and see what is working and see what investments, but [00:39:50] I'm really gonna listen to our team.

[00:39:51] Ruben Harris: Yeah. One, uh, a couple more questions before we move to rapid fire round. Um, you've sold travel through good times [00:40:00] and bad times, 9/11, 2008.

[00:40:01] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Absolutely.

[00:40:02] Ruben Harris: What did those hard times teach you that good years can't?

[00:40:08] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Lion's [00:40:10] fricking mentality, right? Is that your attitude is everything.

[00:40:14] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:40:15] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And that if you go through these hard times, and by the way, in our industry, you [00:40:20] could go back and there's, like, so many you could say.

[00:40:22] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:40:23] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And you have to make the decision, "Am I gonna freeze?"

[00:40:27] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:40:28] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Or I'm gonna go negative and [00:40:30] give up?"

[00:40:30] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:40:30] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Or I'm gonna be completely positive and have a lion's mentality and, and wrap my arms around our team and say, 'Come on, guys, let's go. What do we need to do?'" Mm-hmm. [00:40:40] That, notwithstanding all of the other things- Mm-hmm ... being smart about your spend- Mm-hmm ... making sure that you're making the right business decisions from a [00:40:50] deployment standpoint and, you know, what your experience is.

[00:40:53] Dondra Ritzenthaler: All of those things, if you don't have that mentality, will not have the same result.

[00:40:58] Ruben Harris: Yeah. Makes sense.

[00:40:58] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And that's why I say [00:41:00] that instead of some of these other things that you could say, you know, "I reduced my costs by this," or, "I..." You know, listen, all of that is a must, but you gotta have the [00:41:10] mentality to go, "We are gonna get through this just like we got through everything else, and we're gonna come out ahead of everybody else, 'cause we're not gonna freeze, and we're gonna be smarter, and we're gonna be fearless."

[00:41:19] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And then when [00:41:20] everybody else starts to wake up because they've been frozen, we're way on our way.

[00:41:23] Ruben Harris: Love it. You wanna ask the next question?

[00:41:24] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah. What is one thing in travel that has not changed, in travel sales, I should [00:41:30] say, in the last 20, 40 years?

[00:41:32] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Um, travel advisors Relationships between crew members, guests, travel [00:41:40] advisors, the, the cruise lines, and guests that love cruising.

[00:41:45] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Think about it. Mm-hmm. Right? When we came out of the pandemic, what, it was called revenge travel.

[00:41:48] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:41:49] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And [00:41:50] cruising led that, right? Our customers love to cruise, and that has been so consistent all that time. And our relationship and, [00:42:00] and appreciation and value for travel advisors, and travel advisors' ability to pivot with technology, online agencies, uh, you know, [00:42:10] making it personal, none of that's changed.

[00:42:12] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And the last thing that hasn't changed is my team, my commitment, and my passion for this business, and it will never [00:42:20] change because it's so freaking good. Mm-hmm. It's so good.

[00:42:24] Ruben Harris: Mm-hmm.

[00:42:24] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I love it. So those are the consistent things, Jeff.

[00:42:26] Jeff Herzfeld: Fantastic.

[00:42:27] Ruben Harris: I love it. So now we're gonna transition to the rapid-fire round.

[00:42:30] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Okay, let's go.

[00:42:30] Ruben Harris: Where I ask you a bunch of questions.

[00:42:31] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I hope I can answer them.

[00:42:32] Ruben Harris: No, you got them. The first question that I have is actually, I know we're here in Miami, but you have an accent. Where's that accent come [00:42:40] from?

[00:42:40] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Oh, man, all about Texas. All right. It's Texas, Texas, Texas. And we're, you know, in football season.

[00:42:45] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Uh-huh. And my Dallas Cowboys are getting ready to start. Mm-hmm. So the accent is definitely Texas.

[00:42:50] Ruben Harris: Awesome.

[00:42:50] Jeff Herzfeld: Uh, what is your favorite port that Azamara sails for, sails to, where you're getting that, the most intimate experience that no other cruise line is going to?

[00:42:59] Dondra Ritzenthaler: [00:43:00] So may I give you two?

[00:43:01] Jeff Herzfeld: Sure. Yeah.

[00:43:02] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Um, because the first one that others do go to, but not in the same way...

[00:43:07] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Well, it's rapid fire, so I'm only gonna give you one. It's [00:43:10] Seville, uh, Spain. Okay. Because we get to go up the river. Most can't. In fact, nobody else can. So we go up the river, we go right into the heart of the city, [00:43:20] and then we stay there for two days. And it's really unique for us because everybody else has to stay out and then tender in or, you know, bus, whatever.

[00:43:30] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And, uh, so I love the fact that we get to go there and then we stay so long 'cause there's so much to see.

[00:43:36] Jeff Herzfeld: Can I ask a follow-up? Yeah. If you had to pick one shore excursion to take there, which one would it be?

[00:43:39] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Oh, [00:43:40] my goodness, shore excursion. Um- probably going to see the, you know, the churches when there's, we go when it's Holy Week.

[00:43:50] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And, and you get to go see all of these amazing, when, when it's Holy Week and everybody's there and the energy's good. So I would probably say that. Okay. But there's so many good ones.

[00:43:59] Jeff Herzfeld: That's [00:44:00] awesome.

[00:44:00] Ruben Harris: Thank you. Can you name some of your biggest mentors- Oh ... and maybe one or two pieces of wisdoms that they've shared with you?

[00:44:06] Dondra Ritzenthaler: So, uh, Jack Williams, God rest his soul, he's [00:44:10] gone, uh, was my first mentor. And what he told me was, he said, "Put yourself in the middle and surround, and you're in the middle." [00:44:20] Mm-hmm. "Surround yourself with people that are really, really good at the things that you're not as good at- Mm-hmm ... and listen to them."

[00:44:27] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And that is truly- Okay ... the best [00:44:30] experience any, uh, the best knowledge that I've ever been given. Um, and he told me that. Another mentor, and this is a little corny- Mm-hmm ... and forgive me for this, but it's my mom.

[00:44:40] Ruben Harris: No, that's not corny at all.

[00:44:40] Dondra Ritzenthaler: My mom was a single mom. Mm-hmm. She, uh, had to work two jobs, and yet she was at every single thing I can remember.

[00:44:47] Jeff Herzfeld: Mm-hmm.

[00:44:48] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And I never saw [00:44:50] her panic. And she was the one who told me that, "If you can't get through the front door, go through the window. If the window's closed, go down the chimney. If you don't have a chimney, come up the basement." Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. "But whatever you do, [00:45:00] get in the door." Mm-hmm.

[00:45:01] Ruben Harris: I love that. I, I mean, we, I, Mike and Tommy saw, saw us do it.

[00:45:05] Ruben Harris: Mike is our, from, from our video team. We did an interview with the president of [00:45:10] SNHU, and I was telling her that I'm a product of the matriarchy, my mother, my grandmother. So-

[00:45:14] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Exactly ...

[00:45:15] Ruben Harris: um, y- that's never corny. Never corny.

[00:45:17] Dondra Ritzenthaler: No. Yeah. And I, and, and they really did these [00:45:20] things for me. Mm-hmm. And, you know, it didn't matter if I was selling Girl Scout cookies.

[00:45:24] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. I didn't need the bike, 'cause I already had a bike. I just wanted to win.

[00:45:26] Ruben Harris: My sister did that. Mm-hmm. I love that. Um, what's your favorite book?

[00:45:30] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Oh my goodness. My favorite book is called, uh, Grit.

[00:45:34] Ruben Harris: Okay. It's a good book.

[00:45:34] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm ... and it- you read it?

[00:45:36] Ruben Harris: Yeah, I read it. Yeah.

[00:45:36] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I love it because what it does is it talks about the fact that we [00:45:40] just have to have grit in what we do in life.

[00:45:41] Ruben Harris: It's written by a woman too, right?

[00:45:42] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Uh, you know, I can't remember who it was written by.

[00:45:44] Ruben Harris: I believe so.

[00:45:45] Dondra Ritzenthaler: I believe so, yeah. There's another one that I really love too, and it's called Brave, Not Perfect- Okay ... by Reshma [Saujani]. [00:45:50] Mm-hmm. And she was the first woman who really got women into coding, 'cause coding used to be very much- Yeah

[00:45:56] Dondra Ritzenthaler: male-dominated.

[00:45:56] Ruben Harris: Yep.

[00:45:57] Dondra Ritzenthaler: But what I love about that is that the book [00:46:00] talks about that, as women, sometimes we feel like we have to be too perfect. Mm-hmm. And men feel like they can be more brave. Mm-hmm. And what this book talks about is that we have to be [00:46:10] focused more on being brave and not perfect. Yeah. And I gotta tell you, that book has been really good for me.

[00:46:14] Ruben Harris: I love that. I love that.

[00:46:16] Jeff Herzfeld: Yeah. What do you want people to remember about this conversation?

[00:46:19] Dondra Ritzenthaler: [00:46:20] I hope that people remember, uh, th- this conversation is that I appreciate both of you, number one. I'm glad you're doing this. I hope that they remember that, [00:46:30] um, I am the CEO who believes with all my heart in partnerships, in the fact that I've got a team that is, that is so bright and I listen to [00:46:40] them, and that every single day I bring a lion's mentality, uh, to what I do in my life here and my personal life as well.

[00:46:47] Ruben Harris: That's great. I would've ended on that question, but you said [00:46:50] believe, and then as, as when I walked by your office, I saw the Ted Lasso "Believe." Yes. I love Ted Lasso. And then I also have heard you say blessings, and it made me think about faith. So talk about [00:47:00] belief, faith, and, like, where you think things are going.

[00:47:02] Ruben Harris: Like, what that means to you.

[00:47:04] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah. You know, uh, uh, to me, this is a very personal decision, you know? Mm-hmm. I, um, am very [00:47:10] much a person who believes. I believe in doing the right thing all the time- Mm-hmm ... and that things will happen. I'm very much a, a, a person of faith, you know. Mm-hmm. I think about Dolly Parton, who just lost.

[00:47:19] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Yeah. Rest, rest her [00:47:20] soul. You know, who we just lost, and I love her. Mm-hmm. She was a person of faith. Mm-hmm. And she was very open about that, but it wasn't in any way offensive to anybody else. Mm-hmm. And I think that that's super [00:47:30] important. And you know, the thing I love about Ted Lasso is that he very much believed.

[00:47:35] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Mm-hmm. And that no matter what, no matter how [00:47:40] hard they tried to get him to be negative or to- Mm-hmm ... you know, or to, uh, be derogatory- Mm-hmm ... uh, he wouldn't. Mm-hmm. And that's what I love about him. Mm-hmm. He was [00:47:50] focused, and he had belief, and he had faith, and, and he was a great person and a great partnership, and that's...

[00:47:55] Dondra Ritzenthaler: or he had great partnerships with others. And he eventually won everybody over- Mm-hmm ... [00:48:00] because he was like that, and that's how Dolly Parton is. Mm-hmm. And I hope that someday when I am, like, 100- Mm-hmm ... and I do go- Mm ... that people will feel the same about the way they [00:48:10] thought about Ted Lasso and Dolly Parton.

[00:48:12] Dondra Ritzenthaler: And if I could do that, I will know that I did all right.

[00:48:15] Jeff Herzfeld: Sounds like your vibe attracts your tribe.

[00:48:17] Ruben Harris: For sure. Yeah. So Dondra, we believe in you. [00:48:20] Uh, we appreciate you- Thank you Yeah ... believing in us. Thank you for your time. And everybody, this is The New Normal.

[00:48:24] Jeff Herzfeld: Thank you for joining us. Yeah. Have a great day.

[00:48:26] Dondra Ritzenthaler: Bye.